People say 'Yes' to this?

[Jikanu]

Adoption agencies don't work. Why do you think there are so many kids in foster homes right now and that parents that want to adopt have to go to a foreign country?

It's not because of a lack of kids.



How is this even an argument? People know that they can die in a car crash but that doesn't stop them from driving.

cars werent made specifically for crashing. Sex was made for the specific reason of reproduction. Using it for other reasons is fine, but you accept a risk when you do.

@Hrae: I think the main population issue could be solved through sex ed and empowering women in nations such as India. in places like China, it's a bit different, though. But abortion isnt really the best solution, due to it being considered unethical, immoral, and the fact that it's only really viable in majorly developed countries where population isnt a huge issue.

[Hraesvelg]

But abortion isnt really the best solution, due to it being considered unethical, immoral, and the fact that it's only really viable in majorly developed countries where population isnt a huge issue.

You may consider it as such, but that doesn't make it so. Prevention is the best solution, but a lot of these involve kids too young and dumb to really understand the consequences.

[Jikanu]

Did you see the purely factual part of my comment? Developed countries dont have such a huge population issue; women's empowerment in countries in India can help massively. Also, i forget the name, but there was a country that had one of the world's highest populations, and started a huge birth control campaign that lowered it to the point where it was sustainable again... As for your prevention assertion, wouldnt TRUE prevention be keeping them from getting pregnant in the first place?

[Hraesvelg]

I think I was unclear.

due to it being considered unethical, immoral

That was the bit I was referring to when I said "You may consider it as such, but that doesn't make it so."

And prevention does mean not getting pregnant in the first place. The only way to make that absolute is to spay and neuter teenagers, which I might consider as an option. People keep saying "eugenics" like it's a completely bad thing...

[Jikanu]

you still havent replied to the parts of my statement that were purely fact.... women's empowerment, etc...

@Loki- once again, that's a bit of a different situation. i was referring to the people who have abortions because they dont want to deal with the baby, or because they're not sure financially. when there's a 100% chance that the baby will not live, it's totally different.

And at that, i would like you to know that im totally sorry for your loss.

[Ivramire]

Did you see the purely factual part of my comment? Developed countries dont have such a huge population issue; women's empowerment in countries in India can help massively. Also, i forget the name, but there was a country that had one of the world's highest populations, and started a huge birth control campaign that lowered it to the point where it was sustainable again... As for your prevention assertion, wouldnt TRUE prevention be keeping them from getting pregnant in the first place?

The key part of the first section of your assertion is the word ''developed'' i.e. already having the resources, framework, structure and ethos to have mitigated these problems or don't have them at all. The crux is that the problem is set in the ''developing'' nations i.e. those without the means or even necessarily the will to affect true change. Working to change conditions on-the-ground is well and good, but the difficulty is in the here-and-now. Implementing changes such as the ones prescribed will take time, it's not easy to change what may be engrained in another culture's societal or cultural norms.


While you're working on gradually changing things, the unwanted pregnancies that you're trying to prevent are still going-on. When it comes down to it, what can you really do to stop a woman from having an abortion? Outlaw it in your nation and they go to where they can have it done. It's lack may very well lead to a surge in 'underground' practices hidden from the eyes of the state and thus most unsafe. What could you do with a woman who wanted to have an abortion, against the moral values of everyone else but her own? Force her to carry the baby to term?

[Jikanu]

Ivra:

@Hrae: I think the main population issue could be solved through sex ed and empowering women in nations such as India. in places like China, it's a bit different, though. But abortion isnt really the best solution, due to it being considered unethical, immoral, and the fact that it's only really viable in majorly developed countries where population isnt a huge issue.

India's considered "Developing" still.

Abortion isnt really effective in reducing population.

If that's not what you meant, let me point out another part of my statement you quoted:

Did you see the purely factual part of my comment? Developed countries dont have such a huge population issue; women's empowerment in countries in India can help massively. Also, i forget the name, but there was a country that had one of the world's highest populations, and started a huge birth control campaign that lowered it to the point where it was sustainable again... As for your prevention assertion, wouldnt TRUE prevention be keeping them from getting pregnant in the first place?

[Ivramire]

Ivra:



India's considered "Developing" still.

Abortion isnt really effective in reducing population.

If that's not what you meant, let me point out another part of my statement you quoted:

I'm not really sure why you put-in the italicized parts. I know that India's developing still, that's why I mentioned the developed/developing parts before.


I've actually seen some documentaries on this subject. Not abortion per se but population in developed vs. developing countries. The stuff they're trying to do in India is very interesting. Distribution of condoms, sex-education etc. Funny part is some women said their men didn't want to use the condoms, haha...

[Jikanu]

Which is why women empowerment is so important, once again... letting them make choices instead of being treated like baby machines.

[Hraesvelg]

You say "empowering" women like it's something that can be done by fiat. Hell, look at hard it is to convince someone like you that they might be wrong.