contradiction in the wiki

[morkian33]

I was searching information on chances to refine items, and bonus of bless/lucky stones.

I found two pages which don't says the same thing, which is right?
http://www.fiestafan.com/wiki/Enhancement_Stones
http://www.fiestafan.com/wiki/Enhancement_Guide

ps: 15% for elrue[1] seems inacurate because i usually enchant 4 tier1 item to +3 with 20elrue1 only. (i play on bijou)

[Gandalfa82]

the Enhancement Stones page data is taken straight from the game files. That is the true numbers.

Enhancement Guide is done as a way to explain how to Enhance and not to tell about the stones. The Stone page is done to tell about the stones and not Enhancements. These are done this way so you can find what your looking for without have to hassle with more information then you need.

But I know, cause I was the one that did it, that the Stones pages is completely correct.

[Triumph]

Issue has been resolved.

[Gandalfa82]

Thanks Triumph, I just have not had the time to change that little bit.

[morkian33]

OK so bless stone increases success only by 2%.

Another thing in Enhancement_Stones:
"Examples of this: You have a +2 Weapon and using a lucky stone on it to try to enhance. There will be a 17% chance you will enhance the item to +3. If you are successful at enhancing the item then you will have a 35% chance of getting the weapon to +4 instead of +3"

But lucky elrue[1] which is the more succesful has only 13%.
The 17% is a mistake between lucky and bless or there is a mechanism that i missed?
Thx for your work! Wiki help me a lot.

[Icy]

OK so bless stone increases success only by 2%.

Another thing in Enhancement_Stones:
"Examples of this: You have a +2 Weapon and using a lucky stone on it to try to enhance. There will be a 17% chance you will enhance the item to +3. If you are successful at enhancing the item then you will have a 35% chance of getting the weapon to +4 instead of +3"

But lucky elrue[1] which is the more succesful has only 13%.
The 17% is a mistake between lucky and bless or there is a mechanism that i missed?
Thx for your work! Wiki help me a lot.

Blessed Elrue[1] increases success rate by 17%, the Lucky Elrue[1] counterpart increases it by 13%. And if you use Lucky Elrue[1], 35% of the successes raise enhancement by 2 levels.

I find the "Lucky Sucess Rate" misleading - what about the inherent rate of success? Currently, the probability listed is just P(lucky stone's contribution to success) * P(getting lucky when successful). However, there's also P(inherent probability of success) * P(getting lucky when successful).

[Gandalfa82]

Blessed Elrue[1] increases success rate by 17%, the Lucky Elrue[1] counterpart increases it by 13%. And if you use Lucky Elrue[1], 35% of the successes raise enhancement by 2 levels.

I find the "Lucky Sucess Rate" misleading - what about the inherent rate of success? Currently, the probability listed is just P(lucky stone's contribution to success) * P(getting lucky when successful). However, there's also P(inherent probability of success) * P(getting lucky when successful).

Icy, you are correct about the fact that the chance of being successful or Lucky are not what is showed. But each item you try to enhance has its own numbers for enhancements that must be taken into effect but since this page is not about enhancements but instead it is about Stones I have only put the numbers from the stones on it.

I've done it the best I can given the numbers that Outspark offers in the game. But it would be next to impossible to take all weapons from the game and figure out the different categories and then the Item success rate and factor that into the Stone page. As it is now, the page is about Enhancement Stones and the power ups from Sparks Store that goes with them. That is all. To keep this true then only the stone side of things should be shown. Though feel free to take the numbers and grab the weapon numbers to incorporate into the Enhancement Guide. That would be the best place for that.

Here are the numbers for Elure 1:
Lucky - 13% Success, 35% Luck
Normal - 15% Success
Blessed - 17% Success

The Lucky Success Rate is just the fact that you must be Successful before you can be Lucky. So if you fail the 13% success then you fail the whole thing, only when you fall in that 13% do you have that 35% chance for the lucky enhancement. So the Lucky Success Rate is just how often you will be lucky from the start. If you enhanced 1000 times then you will have 130 Successful Enhancements. 59 will be Lucky when you enhance them. So you Enhance 1000 times and you end up with 71 +1 and 59 +2 Enhancements. So by using this stone you were able to obtain +189 points in Enhancements.

If you Enhance 1000 times with a Bless Stone you would be successful 170 times. That would be 170 +1. Bless stones gives +170 points in Enhancements. Normal will give 150 +1 so +150 points in Enhancements.

If you only add the numbers that goes up then you would have:
Normal - 150 times
Bless - 170 times
Lucky - 189 times.

But that is not a true recap of the success only the raw points you get from 1000 tries.

[Icy]

I was only lectured on probability last term so I remember what they mean -.-

If you say that the Lucky Success Rate is not misleading, show a useful calculation that can be done with it, correctly.

Apart from that, there's no problem with the other columns, so there's nothing that's needed to be done to them.

[Gandalfa82]

The only useful calulation is to know the percent that you will get the lucky +2 as opossed to the standard +1 of a success. That is just to show the rate that the +2 will come over all.

I figure if people are using Lucky stones over Blessed stones it is cause they are hoping for the +2 Lucky Enhance so I added that column to show them the rate that these enhancements should come as they are upgrading items. If it is redundant or unneeded feel free to remove it.

What I wished I could find is the Degrade and Brakage Rates for the diffrent stones/items. That I am currently looking into.

[Icy]

The only useful calulation is to know the percent that you will get the lucky +2 as opossed to the standard +1 of a success. That is just to show the rate that the +2 will come over all.

I'm saying that you can calculate neither the overall Lucky Success Rate nor Increased Lucky Success Rate without knowing the success rate inherent from the item, as you earlier said. Therefore, that column is misleading. Come all who disagree and I will enlighten you.