Ian Thomlinson. - Page 3

Hazu · 05-24-2009, 07:33 AM

Quote:

i'll pay taxes as long as they go to programs that i support.

Some how that made me think of during hurricane katrina a lady said she would not donate if any of the goods went to black people.

But the point is...... not saying you're comment was racist, just an example... that we wont always agree to what our money goes to. Some experimenting or testing you dont like. Research in Nasa you might not agree with. A jail you dont want put up near your house. Just because you don't like something doesnt mean to cut off and cause more trouble for yourself.

And government and the people rely on eachother.

Also... without bad in the world what would we know what was good? We have to have a equal balance and so I wouldnt exaclty say the world was evil.

I understand you're opinion and I used to think the same way... I still dont have to pay taxes, will soon probably.

lol and doesnt matter you're age if you can make a difference in something. Just make sure you do research on the subject before trying to protest it. (just stating this on any subject)

Jikanu · 05-24-2009, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by Hazu

Some how that made me think of during hurricane katrina a lady said she would not donate if any of the goods went to black people.

But the point is...... not saying you're comment was racist, just an example... that we wont always agree to what our money goes to. Some experimenting or testing you dont like. Research in Nasa you might not agree with. A jail you dont want put up near your house. Just because you don't like something doesnt mean to cut off and cause more trouble for yourself.

And government and the people rely on eachother.

Also... without bad in the world what would we know what was good? We have to have a equal balance and so I wouldnt exaclty say the world was evil.

I understand you're opinion and I used to think the same way... I still dont have to pay taxes, will soon probably.

lol and doesnt matter you're age if you can make a difference in something. Just make sure you do research on the subject before trying to protest it. (just stating this on any subject)

Perhaps i phrased that in the wrong way. i mean something i feel is at it's core morally wrong. like Thoreau, and the American-Mexican War, which was clearly morally wrong.

And im not saying that evil would be wiped out, just massive corruption that resulted in total abuses of power like in this case.

Originally Posted by Yosei

We'd go down with them, if not, first.

You can't control where your taxes go, but you can think that theres one huge bank for the government, you just deposited $1,000, and then the next day, a family is going to get $1,000 worth of food stamps, maybe your money didn't go directly to that, but it contributed.

The longest you can go without paying taxes if 4 years I believe.

There ARE, however, programs where your money will go more directly to the people who need it. If you pay 1000 dollars to the gov, for example, i doubt more than 1-10 dollars of that will acctually go towards someone who needs it. The rest will go to the government, the unjust wars, the nuclear war programs, and the giant corporations that are in their pockets. Why not donate to charity programs that acctually make a difference?

**Yosei** · 05-24-2009, 05:08 PM

Because you were talking about taxes.

You have to pay taxes. Its the law. And what does it matter where exactly your tax money goes? Like I said... it doesn't go directly anywhere, but it contributes. Just think about the programs that it'd be contributing to. For instance... unemployment. Many car factories are closing down and workers are going out of the job. They can apply for unemployment, where they get paid money every week from the government until they can find a job.

I don't know if you've even read my posts ._.

If it weren't for the government, my family would be out on the streets. Is the government so bad there?

The government has both of my parents on unemployment. They're getting food stamps, from the government, the kids get free lunches and other fee waivers, because of the government, who is paying for those things. The kids get Toys for Tots every year, because of the government and marines. I got to apply to college and take my SATs for free, because of the government. When a kid applies for their FAFSA to get financial aid from the government, their parents have to have paid their taxes. But its worth it, because they get to go to college!

**Ralath** · 05-24-2009, 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by Ralath

And just think the precedent that this would set. If the government allowed so many people to not pay their taxes just because the people didn't like what the government was doing, then the government wouldn't function right now.

Furthermore, do you really think the government would allow so many people not to pay their taxes? The government has more power now than before to seize upon your other property, take away privileges, etc.

I doubt Thoreau's civil disobedience would have worked in this era.

Was he even effective in his own time? (Rhetorical question alert)

Jikanu · 05-24-2009, 06:26 PM

Im not saying everything that they do is wrong, and it seems you didnt read my post. Im saying that if your money goes to, for example, waging war on a small country to take its land, and natural resources, and therefore hurt its people, yuou should keep the money you would spend on taxes and give it to a WORTHY cause, like charity that has the money go DIRECTLY to the families that need it. it seems you didnt read that part of my post :/

As long as the reason why you were refusing to pay taxes got across, the government would eventually have to buckle and give the people what they want.

But assuming it doesnt work, what form of peaceful protest would you reccomend?

**Ralath** · 05-24-2009, 06:32 PM

You can give your money to charity all you want.

But do charity run public schools? Build roads? Provide healthcare? Provide unemployment? Fund research? Ensure national security? The list goes on.

Maybe some of them do. But not on the massive scale the U.S. government does.

There are plenty of ways to engage in peaceful protest. People do it all the time. Use the rights given to you in the Constitution (which do not include not paying your taxes).

Jikanu · 05-24-2009, 06:58 PM

Which ways are you suggesting? picket signs, and marches? those rarely do much, with a couple of exceptions which were due to fantastic leaders (such as martin luther king). The government doesnt care about what you think, as long as it has your money.

**Hraesvelg** · 05-24-2009, 08:03 PM

Originally Posted by Jikanu

As long as the reason why you were refusing to pay taxes got across, the government would eventually have to buckle and give the people what they want.

The government, and the IRS in particular, don't care about why you wouldn't be paying. If you've got assets enough to tax, they will seize them and take more than their cut. They will go have lunch, then do it again. They will sleep soundly at night.

But, be my guest. Then let us know what happens, if you're not living in a box.

Jikanu · 05-24-2009, 09:43 PM

*shrugs* i probably wont. im just trying to come out with ways to stand up against them in a way that'll get their attention. please, if you have any suggestions, i would appreciate them.

**Ralath** · 05-24-2009, 10:06 PM

I don't really see what you're asking for when there isn't a well-defined answer to begin with and the answers that exist are around you already. Change (for better, for worse) happens every day whether you believe it or not.

If you want to find ways to "stand up," pick up a newspaper and see how other people have managed to do it.