Deity Existence

[Vasu]

There's also the question of which religion to follow if you believe in a personal God. Do you follow Vishnu? Buddha? Yahweh? Or Jupiter? If you're Christian, and it turns out the Greeks were right all along, Hades is going to be pissed at you when you end up at Erebus/Tartarus.

[Deoial]

There's also the question of which religion to follow if you believe in a personal God. Do you follow Vishnu? Buddha? Yahweh? Or Jupiter?

just wanted to point out Buddha is not a god in fact the whole Buddhist's religion has no higher power. Thus its basis of appeal to me just wanted to clarify.

[Triumph]

It seems that most of FF leans toward the agnostic side.

My argument is whether or not it can be proven that there is a deity of sorts, or not. Geological records of the Earth indicate that Earth was formed billions of years ago—along with fossilized remains of organisms that no longer exist today. The Bible says that the Earth was created in seven days. This can be argued as impossible, since it's evident that many billions of years of have elapsed before we have gotten to this day and age.

Yet, Christianity has its own argument. The Lomonosov-Lavoisier law (AKA the Law of Conservation of Matter/Mass) states that "matter cannot be created nor destroyed." The Big Bang theory, as advocated by many scientists, has one key flaw: Where did this matter come from? If an enormous explosion occurred, it would certainly blast matter the way the universe is currently expanding. However, no good explanation for where the matter came from exists.

I will say that I advocate the Big Bang theory over Creationism, despite the flaws. The concept of an insubstantial entity creating a world seems far more far-fetched. No offense.

[Vasu]

There is one question that I have not seen satisfactorily answered in any of the forums I have seen for a discussion of this sort.

If God is omnipotent, can he make an object so heavy he cannot lift?

The answers I have seen so far are:

1. That is an illogical question and a contradiction. It's like asking if god can make a circle with corners, or other impossibilities.

2. God is beyond logic.

3. God can only do what is logically possible.

Rebuttals:

1. It's only a contradiction for an omnipotent being. None of us can make a circle with corners because that is a contradiction in terms. But each and every one of us can make an object so heavy that we cannot lift it. Does that make me more powerful than god? So that's in effect saying, "God can do anything, except that which he cannot do", which is a waste of words.

2. "God is beyond logic, and can therefore not be discussed using logic." Even this statement is derived by simple logic. Logic drips through every implication, and every inference made. Nothing "transcends" logic.

3. Yeah, and making a whole universe out of nothing is really logical. See rebuttal 1 as well.

If you have any other replies to this, please do post.

Also, god cannot be omnipotent and omniscient at the same time. It's explained by this handy little verse I picked up from "The God Delusion":

Can omniscient God, who
Knows the future, find
The omnipotence to
Change His future mind?

Any input on this would also be appreciated.

And of course if anybody would care to answer the "What created God?" question, that would be nice too.