Deity Existence

[Vasu]

You're forgetting the difference between old and new testament... He had to be strict and imprint a powerful moral code on humanity. they didnt listen when he gave them love in the garden of Eden, so he had to show how powerful he was.

Or he could instil in all of them a deep love of each other, and of god, and avoid all the bloodshed. Efficiency FTW?

And i honestly havent read up enough on religion to know enough to answer your arguments accurately. But perhaps the insanity some are born with are part of his plan; some of the insane have done good things, like van gough.

What plan? It's all our free will remember? And what "good things" did van Gogh do?

[Ivramire]

The point of free will is we do what we feel we must do. Instilling anything kinda contravenes that.


I'm assuming the ''Plan'' is a general direction that humanity should take, towards mutual understanding and love :shrug:


Van Gogh's ''good things'' I assume would be his contributions to art.

[Vasu]

The point of free will is we do what we feel we must do. Instilling anything kinda contravenes that.

But helping Moses and co. out of Egypt doesn't contravene that?

I'm assuming the ''Plan'' is a general direction that humanity should take, towards mutual understanding and love :shrug:

And that doesn't contravene free will? I thought we could do whatever we want, and the only retribution would be in an unproven, unprovable afterlife.

Van Gogh's ''good things'' I assume would be his contributions to art.

How are those "good things"?

[Hraesvelg]

I'd consider any sort of contribution to the beauty of the world a good thing. I don't think any sort of supernatural poppycock was behind it, though. The line between madness and genius has always been a thin one.

[Vasu]

It may be beauty to you, and squiggles to me.

[Hraesvelg]

If you think Van Gogh is squiggles, you're just an uncultured rube, LOL.

[Ivramire]

Oy, try to avoid friendly-fire.

But helping Moses and co. out of Egypt doesn't contravene that?

Nope.

Divine Intervention is your Get Out of Egypt Card.

Send all your Favor to the Graveyard.

Do not collect $200.

And that doesn't contravene free will? I thought we could do whatever we want, and the only retribution would be in an unproven, unprovable afterlife.

You seem to have a problem with the concept of free-will as I understand it. Assuming God's omniscience is true, him knowing what decision we will make beforehand doesn't change that it was our decision in the first place.


I do think that our lives are what we make of it, Heaven and Hell is right here, right now.

[Vasu]

If you think Van Gogh is squiggles, you're just an uncultured rube, LOL.

But the fact remains that it's subjective. Saying it's beautiful doesn't make you "right" and saying it's squiggles doesn't make me wrong. So it could be just a waste of paint for me.

Oy, try to avoid friendly-fire.

Nope.

Divine Intervention is your Get Out of Egypt Card.

Send all your Favor to the Graveyard.

Do not collect $200.

That...was a joke right? Just to be sure.

You seem to have a problem with the concept of free-will as I understand it. Assuming God's omniscience is true, him knowing what decision we will make beforehand doesn't change that it was our decision in the first place.

I do think that our lives are what we make of it, Heaven and Hell is right here, right now.

True, but that fact that he just sits there and does nothing, means that while he may be a supporter of free will, he is not benevolent.

[Ivramire]

Not a fan myself, but Van Gogh did move things in interesting directions. Regardless of the art itself, the influence on others isn't to be taken lightly.


I'm pretty sure the ''benevolent'' vs. ''free-will'' thing was addressed before. Sure he/she/it wants what's best for us and that means letting us make our own mistakes. Like the apt example of a parent, you can't coddle them forever.

[Jikanu]

Yeah... insanity can be looked at in two ways: as something that makes people violently insane, or something that gives a whole different perspective on life. i think that it's the choice on how you filter your insanity that matters in the end.