25 SPR? What for?
 

We want that minuscule 5% critical bonus.

25 end = bout 125hp? I'm sure my 5% crit hit will go thru that 125 extra hp of yours in 1 hit and then some.

^ Hmm, interesting point.

Not necessarily.

You have 95% - (weapon critical) - (license critical), which varies it. Even still, it's around 90% chance of not landing a critical.

The END, on the other hand, will always be there. Not to mention block and increased defense, 25 END = 2.5% block rate. It's not much, but it adds up. Not to mention about 12 extra defense as well.

Really, i think the best stat is SPR, til 25, since others don't give much. Compare all stat if you put 25 to them. @ lvl 20, you'd have +25 damage (int/str) wooptidoo! With end you get 125 hp + some block, if you got a shield (big deal). And dex, you get little more aim and dodge (hardly noticable). With SPR i get 5% chance to kill classes/mobs quicker.

surprisingly... 5% crit rate boost your chance of crit-ing a lot! (sounds a bit funny.. as if i'm talking about a kilo of brick is actually a lot heavier than you think)

anyway...

i had a Marlone King Hammer (or watever it was called) with a nicee 9% crit.. and i had times where i do triple crits... at max.. my other normal hammer only did a double...

1 crit every 10 hit (10% crit, 5% from weapon, 5% from spr) is better than 1 crit every 20 hits (for only 5% crit)... but personally i think my chances of critting is more frequent than the pure number they gave us....

EDIT: i'm saying the same thing as Triumph but in a positive light kekeke

I have 24 points in STR, and I hit 30-40 more than a cleric my level does.

For example: I hit 140 on Harkans. My friend with END:SPR hits 100.

Same level, same +3 hammer.

It's a personal preference, but your perspective is as a mage: Your class just plows through monsters. Other classes that aren't as fast look at more of a survival build (as in take less damage and do more damage overall) rather than a nuke build. I'll accept the fact that a mage is pretty damn powerful, but endurance-wise, a cleric wins, hands down.

he depends on wat u're looking at.. ur frd could would be able to take on an extra hit or two from the karkans compare to u without those outs in END...

so yeah... u gain some u lose some!

i dont think u can compare a lvl 39 to a lvl 32... that's actually a very big level difference...

Well for me, I'm not really built to do a lot of damage but I like the extra crit %+ and the small boost of SP & M. Def. It sort of helps when there's no Mage in the party and I sometimes have to tank a magic-casting monster.

@MagesRequiem: Well it's all about personal preferences, I usually spam debuffs on the monsters I'm training on. And since I sometimes usually solo, it helps to have that extra critical hit rating when I tank monsters.

5% crit is useful even if you dont spam skill... i dont understand why u said u hv to spam skill to make it useful... any crit is good for me.. bonus if its a skill... also.. mage's atk rate is slower than other classes (skill cool down) so u do relatively less hits per min, hence less crits per min... its probably not worth it for u .. but for other class with a faster atk speed.. we have more chance of getting crit

but yeah i guess mages need that END coz u guys hv poor defence...

fighters already hv a pretty good defence from normal lvl stats (at least they dont die in 3 hits XD) so they can afford to put more pts in SPR over END compare to Mage...

these extra stats pts are just given to us so we can build our character to be strong in the way that we want.... if u prefer more def over more dmg... then... so be it.. others prefer more crits and SP over defence.. they let them be....

Note: This is all a generalization

Normal Weapon(3% crit) = 1 out of every 33 attacks crit
Advance Weapon(5% crit) = 1 out of every 20 attacks crit
Specialty Weapon(9% crit) = 1 out of every 11 attacks crit

Normal Weapon(3% crit + 1% earring) = 1 out of every 25 attacks crit
Advance Weapon(5% crit + 1% earring) = 1 out of every 18 attacks crit
Specialty Weapon(9% crit + 1% earring) = 1 out of every 10 attacks crit


Normal Weapon(3% crit + 1% earring + 5%spr) = 1 out of every 11 attacks crit
Advance Weapon(5% crit + 1% earring + 5%spr) = 1 out of every 9 attacks crit
Specialty Weapon(9% crit + 1% earring + 5%spr) = 1 out of every 7 attacks crit

Just a generalization of how small percentage points do make a difference.

1 crit every 9 attacks is pretty often!
looking at adv weapon would all the crit bundle

Green Xbow = 8%
Conqueror Title = 5%
75 SPR Points (lvl 60) = 10%
Crit Earrings = 1%
Crit Costume = 25%

49% Crit by level 60.

Plus the 25 spr you get adds enough SP for 75 magic missles...Same concept applies to M.Def any little bit counts.

25 SPR BUILD IS NOT OVER RATED!

^.^


----^ Win.

From my experience, around level 25-26 a pure INT mage really became hard for me because I died very very quick. Remade my made and did 25 spr(remember you get this by level 20), I have much more sp, crit at least 1-2 times each monster, and using aim scroll I don't miss much.

I have 25 SPR on my cleric.

Why? Because I want that extra SPR and crit.

But it only gives a little SPR and a little crit!

Well, I'm satisfied with what it gives.

I don't know if I actually crit significantly more, but I feel like I do crit quite a bit, although I don't know if that's just me thinking I crit more. I never go all technical and mathematical with these things. G___G" But yeah, I like it. I don't think I crit this much in closed beta when I had no SPR at all.

Like Enrei (I think) said, it's all personal preference. If that little extra bit of sp and crit doesn't satisfy you, then don't put it in. If it does, then by all means, go chuck your 25 points there. Whether you add it or not, both have their own ups and downs, so it's pretty even at the end.

Lemme ask you,as one of the persons who helped start if not create the idea of 25 spr.

What stats are better really?
Str/int? 25 points in damage increase is WORTHLESS in your character sheet. My lvl 40 warrrior had about 600-700 damage with a 2handed sword( IN THE CHARACTER SHEET). If had put 45 points into strength it would have increased to 650-750 which at most increases damage on mobs my level by 10-20 points. Hardly WORTH IT.
End- 125 points of Hp? thats chip away quickly 12 defense? WORTHLESS. It would help with shielders but only to an extent
Dex- Do i really need to explain this one?

5% crit rate helps ALOT especially in pvp where you'll be REQUIRED to spam skills like Britney spears on crack

Extra crit weapons are not hard to get...Especially in the higher tiers levels...

And mage i'm sorry man But i don't see Pure int getting you as far as you think later in the game...

Well I like the extra 25 spr. 5% from that and 5% from my axe will give me a 10% crit rate. That is alot. The figures might not be big but trust me. You'll be critting a lot. And that's only from the stat and weapon. Lets say you get a thunder axe. 7% crit. Mob Annihilator 4%. Sign of Mara 1%. That totals up to a whooping 17% crit rate.

Thats a much different issue you need to find good party mates. I usually ditch my party if the cleric is bad and none of my friends are in there.

If anything end could atleast give aoe groups a hand...

lol.

Current Weapon : 5% Crit
25 SPR : 5% Crit
Max'd Lic : 5% Crit
Earrings : 2%
Event Items : 5% Crit
Total : 22% Crit

This isnt including the Crit bonus you get from base stats, and SPR bonuses from equipment. Base SPR is the same as Equipment SPR, and although it doesnt raise as much crit as FreeStat SPR, it still adds to crit, although I currently havent calculated how much exactly.

Around 1/4th of the time I crit, and that -does- make a difference. In the end, 25 SPR isnt for everyone, its for well-thought out builds looking at the "Bigger" Picture.

The exact opposite is true, actually.

Actually what he said was true through the first 40 levels atleast...

well i think that adding the crit that a weapon already has, combined with that 5% spr means you can easily get at least 8-11% crit which is basically 1 crit every 10 attacks, and from my perspective its very good to have a crit that frequently. now i dont have that i have about 6% with my Crusader and 1.xx% crit i have with the meager 4 points of SPR i have added but i get crits of 200+ on orcs at lvl 34! so wether or not you get multiple increases and they are small doesnt matter. just remember, there is bound to be a cap somewhere for INT,and END so why not toss a few more down the SPR alley so that you may end up not cursing urself when ppl are adding more to SPR for the sweet crit buff it gives them and you dont get a crit but once in a blue moon ^_^

Nobody actually really does this. Its a conspiracy to play chinese mind games on you o_o

Chinese mind games scare me lol:D

I always like to use a bit of mathcraft to help in situations like this.

Lets take a look at the case of 25 SPR vs. 25 STR (i play a fighter, can replace with INT in case of mages.) Since a crit is effectively 200% damage, and happens X% of the time, the formula to figure out your effective damage per blow is your weapon damage + (weapon damage * crit %)

Let's assume a weapon critrate of 5%, 2% crit earrings.

Damage 100
25 STR: 130+(130*.07)=139.1
25 SPR: 100+(100*.12)=112.0

Damage 300
25 STR: 330+(330*.07)=353.1
25 SPR: 300+(300*.12)=336.0

Damage 500
25 STR: 530+(530*.07)=567.1
25 SPR: 500+(500*.12)=560.0

Damage 700
25 STR: 730+(730*.07)=781.1
25 SPR: 700+(700*.12)=784.0

Damage 1000
25 STR: 1030+(1030*.07)=1102.1
25 SPR: 1000+(1000*.12)=1120.0

See the trend? Keep in mind that stats like STR/INT add nothing but the damage, the SPR adds SP and MDef as well, as WELL as outdamaging the STR/INT categories.

I personally feel like SPR up to 25 is the best stat in the game hands down for value.

If you plan to have a higher critrate outside of your SPR, i.e. through full licences on weapons, potions, scrolls, etc., the point at which 25 SPR catches up to 25 STR/INT in damage is higher. To give you a general idea, i am currently level 45, and am in the ~damage 700 scenario, so my damage is just breaking even between the STR and SPR choices. However, the higher I level past this point, the more valuable the extra critical is relative to the extra damage.

The bottom line is that 25 SPR is always eventually superior to 25 of whatever your damage stat is. Unless you only plan to play up to level ~40 and quit, there is no situation where you can excuse not taking 25 SPR.


Hope this helps.

math: it works bitches

You can tank no matter where your stats go. You're forgetting natural stat growth. My full endurance fighter's tanking ability isn't much more compared to the spirit fighter I played back in CB2. The reality is, the higher your level, the smaller the impact free stats have on your character.

However, I do support full endurance on fighters because it improves your tanking ability on a percentage basis with block, I'm not too concerned about the defense or HP bonuses at all, as they can be replaced via scrolls. Pretty much anything that amplifies your stats via percentage is worth getting because their value in your later levels won't dull.