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-   -   Deity Existence (http://www.fiestafan.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15388)

Hraesvelg 04-17-2009 06:07 PM

That's not far off, actually. While the abiogenesis question isn't completely answered, there are several explanations, including the RNA-world and iron-sulfur-world models which seem viable. Time, observation, and experimentation will tell.

Aidan 04-17-2009 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jikanu (Post 324434)
where does the instinct come from though? that's what confuses me. where do they get the need to sustain themselves?

It's just like how did we get this "soul"? Normal animals show some primitive emotions, but we never see animals "aware" of themselves, their actions, and none try to ever debate their origin or other scientific things.

That may be how the Divine being comes in.

Ivramire 04-17-2009 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jikanu (Post 324211)
The fact that it's animalistic nature to go for different partners, yet the force of love makes us human? that Love can make you feel a way in which you would sacrifice yourself? that there's no logical explaination for the comlete dedication of yourself to another person, yet it still feelss completely right?


It's an evolutionary strategy. Pair-bonding that is purely monogamous provides a ''stable'' base for potential high-quality offspring. Logical enough?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Jikanu (Post 324406)
So everything just happened to end up the way it is by chance? the sun just happened to be the right distance from the earth? H2O just happened to form on our planet, while on most other planets we've discovered have none in its liquid form? i find that very hard to believe.


Try looking at it from another way. Would there be an idea of a God if we did not exist? Similar to the philosophical staple of ''Does a falling-tree make a sound if noone hears it?'' In a billion possibilities where it didn't turn out so well, there wouldn't be anyone to ask that question, maybe it just so happens that it did.

Life may exist in forms that we have not discovered, sentience is much rarer true, but not possibly low enough to be dismissed. Out of the millions of systems and uncounted planets, are you truly confident enough to dismiss them all?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Jikanu
where does the instinct come from though? that's what confuses me. where do they get the need to sustain themselves?

Evolution is a likely answer. Organisms without any drive would very obviously not bother to do anything. They die = no propagation of DNA. Even the simplest of single-celled organisms will try to sustain itself and eventually reproduce.

Jikanu 04-17-2009 06:25 PM

That's like asking "if you fixed and then broke a video camera, would you have ever created it?" Just because we arent here doesnt affect the existance of anything that came before us.

And once again, i never dismissed the theory of life on other planets, i clearly said the planets that we have discovered harbor no life. im simply asking, is it truly probable that everything around us was formed by chance?

pigspark 04-17-2009 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ivramire (Post 324447)
It's an evolutionary strategy. Pair-bonding that is purely monogamous provides a ''stable'' base for potential high-quality offspring. Logical enough?





Try looking at it from another way. Would there be an idea of a God if we did not exist? Similar to the philosophical staple of ''Does a falling-tree make a sound if noone hears it?'' In a billion possibilities where it didn't turn out so well, there wouldn't be anyone to ask that question, maybe it just so happens that it did.

Life may exist in forms that we have not discovered, sentience is much rarer true, but not possibly low enough to be dismissed. Out of the millions of systems and uncounted planets, are you truly confident enough to dismiss them all?

it is quite true even though i am only 13 this is what i think. humans ar exactly like animals. they can also be life all over in other planets however slight the chance is. The divine or god as people will call it can possibly be a little atom or something tht gave a tiny jerk into life. for their isnt any proof tht god actually exists. So i am forced to believe tht people who call this god a god is actually or possibly be a atom a particule the universe or other countless possibilities.

Aidan 04-17-2009 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ivramire (Post 324447)
Life may exist in forms that we have not discovered, sentience is much rarer true, but not possibly low enough to be dismissed. Out of the millions of systems and uncounted planets, are you truly confident enough to dismiss them all?

We may want to be careful on that though. It makes me remember a science fiction story I read once of an alien race that was heavy into exploring and science. One of their scouts lands on a planet that has life, only to find that the creatures on the planet were very well developed psychically. The creatures boarded the scout's ship and went to the race's homeworld. The curious alien race that was so eager to find life was enslaved for thousands of years due to their nature.

Sad tale. Irrelevant to our discussion, but a sad tale.

Hraesvelg 04-17-2009 06:31 PM

To use an example that Douglas Adams once used, "...imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in, an interesting hole I find myself in, fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!' This is such a powerful idea that as the sun rises in the sky and the air heats up and as, gradually, the puddle gets smaller and smaller, it's still frantically hanging on to the notion that everything's going to be alright, because this world was meant to have him in it, was built to have him in it; so the moment he disappears catches him rather by surprise. I think this may be something we need to be on the watch out for. "

Ivramire 04-17-2009 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jikanu (Post 324451)
That's like asking "if you fixed and then broke a video camera, would you have ever created it?" Just because we arent here doesnt affect the existance of anything that came before us.

That is again based on the assumption that there was a pregenitor who created everything to begin with. The whole point of the thread.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Jikanu (Post 324451)
And once again, i never dismissed the theory of life on other planets, i clearly said the planets that we have discovered harbor no life. im simply asking, is it truly probable that everything around us was formed by chance?


Of the planets that we have discovered, how many have actually been scoured for what we term as life? Two?

Might be a mite too early to make assumptions.


^Hitchhiker?

Should really read that.

Jikanu 04-17-2009 06:34 PM

so basically you're saying not to feel too content with our surroundings to the point that when things change we have no ability to adapt?

EDIT: that was meant for hrae.

I do believe that there might be life on other planets, im simply saying is it at all likely that all life in the universe was formed by chance?

Hraesvelg 04-17-2009 06:38 PM

The point is to not have the hubris to think that just because we fit well into this environment that it was made to order, i.e., that the universe was created to suit our needs.


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