*shrugs* You said one thing, but when it would not change people's mind, you said it was for people who knew nothing about weed. Just wondering which it was.

No reason to be so defensive, lol.

I think Mikey's hoping that education about the topic from more than the usual sources will help broaden the opinions of usage of weed. He probably hopes it will change some minds, but if it doesn't, hopefully it will at least make someone think about the topic from a different angle. Please don't hold his lack of eloquence against his noble intentions. : )

LOL hraes right. Im not all intelligent and don't have superior knowledge of the subject there fore cannot answer everything people ask. But his reason is exactly what I had intended with posting the video.

Ever wonder if you could become intelligent and actually post what you mean...... I mean if you weren't most when you were high?

:smile:

And now can mods get infractions for insulting other members? come the fuck on.

Or atleast make some sense if your attempting to insult me.

I have not insulted you. Calm down. I am merely repeating what YOU have said in THIS thread. And make fun of my typos, so what. I could point out about 100 you have made in this thread.

In the post above my last one you admitted that you were not intelligent and that you did not have superior knowledge. Further on up you admitted that most of the time you are posting on this forum you are high. I am just asking if you think maybe the two go hand in hand.

All part of the great debate on how pot does/does not affect your thinking.

I used your own words against you. Words that you said about yourself and you get pissy. If you want to bring it up, prepare to back it up.


And I do not have to insult you. You are doing that yourself. You just don't see it.

lrva and I share the same thought.

It's down to the individuals. The laws were designed to protect the whole community. They're not always perfect but that's what a democracy is for. The laws do change with time, in fact.

As of now, people constantly abuse drugs, e.g. marijuana, so it's fair to criminalise its use.

Then again, you wonder why alcohol is legal while the trail of social and personal devastation it cases is more or less similar to pot, comparatively speaking.

First off, I've never seen the reason I've gotten infractions either
so can you see how maybe you could have insulted me without realizing?
Second off I never fucking stood there and said that I am un-intelligent. If i was I dont think I could even be typing to you. I said and meant I am not all knowing, I do not have vast information on many subjects like someone like hrae, as I'm still young and havent learned everything ofcourse.

Yeah Im baked right now and still see the fuckin bullshit your pumping out.
Comon spirit you know your just loving the chance to insult me.

Two and two go in hand?

Take an already stupid person and give them weed, there already fuckin dumb and weed didnt cause it ( and no im not talking about myself )

Just like if you take a person whos lazy and doesnt wanna get a job
give em pot, its not weed thats making them like that, there gunna be lazy anyways. And im not making fun of any fuckin grammar except when im being insulted and I cant understand whats being said to me.

And yet you sit here and pick out my small flaws instead of seeing the big picture.

You just said it all right there Mikey. Number 1 by totally NOT getting what I was saying.

It was a Serious question. I think a lot of people have put in their posts how pot affect our thought process.

Take it as an insult if you want.

Or you could have turned it into a great debate. But, meh, why think about it, when get pissed is so much easier.

Do you know why Hrae can actually debate this topic better than you?

Has nothing to do with age or knowledge.

He actually takes the time to read the posts and thinks about what is being said and looks at multiple views. Then he actually thinks about what he types in response. He does not jump into anger-mode and go off in a rage.

He and I do not always share the same views, but at least I can debate with him. And neither of us go off the handle.


Enjoy Mikey. :smile:

Think what you want, I was trying to give you a debatable topic, but hell you are just proving my point.

Please, keep a debate going or do not post. It is going off topic.

Ofcourse he can, Im not here to debate, hence why this
was not posted in mature discussions.

And all that was posted in here i never freaked out and
got "pissy" at other then the one where I'm being insulted.

And theres no need to sit there and tell me hrae can debate this
topic better then me because ofcourse I already understand that.

If i was to sit and read what you said over and over and thought
about it I still cant turn that into a great debate because its just stupid.
You, as alot of people have the image of, think stoners are braindead and just like the idiots that are put into movies.

You like apple computers? Created by a stoner. Cnn? again stoners, comon, you just keep edging me on to and you know it with your " your just proving my point". What the fuck do you think im gunna say to that shit?

And blaaahs im pretty sure whats goin on still has to do with the subject, but again theres a reason I did not post this in mature discussions and I never asked it be mvoed there so why was it?


edit: an arguement with you is one I cannot win
therefore if you have only something to say back to me there is no point.

tl;dr

Seriously, I could only watch about 3 minutes before going back. I'm sure it's informative, just not my thing.

LOL. <3

It was not staying on topic because it went on about how to debate and who would debate better rather than about marijuana.

We moved it because we figured this thread will go in a better direction if it had been posted in Mature Discussions. It had turned into a nice debate about whether marijuana should be legalized or not as well as touching on the topic about the effects of it (which is what your OP was about).

Had it been left in MoS, the posts may not have turned out so pretty and we would have closed it and there goes your effort.

However if you'd like, I'll move it back to MoS as per OP's request. Though if anything "bad" starts, we won't be trying to put the flames down like we do here because we hope for a good discussion in MD, but not in MoS.

Also, don't double post. You've done it twice in this thread already and you know you can't double post here.

Keep it here as theres still people would I guess could debate it.
Though people keep seeming to miss my point of posting. ( glad some people dont have their heads in their asses and see why though )

As for double posting yeah I've been a naughty boy.

As we saw.

I also agree.

Plus it just annoys me when people act like complete idiots.

Everyone needs to act like an idiot once in a while.
If not I should tell you to pull the stick out of your ass and do it.

Mikey I understand the point of your thread. You want to show people that think Weed is evil that it isn’t. Weed is cool, fun, enjoyable, and isn’t really that harmful. Your point of view is somewhat of a sheltered point of view from what you have said though. From what you have told everyone your mom makes really great money, and keeping that in mind, would mean that you live in a really nice neighborhood, go to a really safe school, and lack for nothing in life. So your experiences with weed are getting high, watching TV, laughing, and eating a bag of chips. You bright and shining colors to paint a picture when it comes to Weed.

But there are many colors that can be used to paint this picture and some of them are dark and dingy. I grew up in an inner city where drugs were plentiful and the things I saw were not all laughs and fun.

1. Man gets high abducts a six year old by knife point and forces the little boy to do things only taking breaks to smoke a little more weed. Man lets the boy go but tells him that if he says anything that the Man would kill the boys family.

2. Man gets high and beats his wife and kids.

3. Man gets high and molests his wife’s little brother.

4. Kids get high and drive their car off a bridge.

5. Kid gets high and decides to see what would happen if he jumped off the top of a house.

6. Man needs to smoke weed so bad that he gets high the night before a urine test. He ends up going to jail for breaking his probation.

7. Man who decides that weed just isn’t enough so he moves on to cocaine, meth, and crack.

These are not in any statistics. The above are just a few real life events that may not make up the norm of what happens when a person gets high. But they have happened and do happen. So, if you really want more knowledge about the subject, you should try and not be so closed minded to others beliefs and experiences. If you think it’s all flowers and sunshine then fine, but don’t try and trivialize the experiences of others.

Ohhh and before you ask I was involved personally to every event in the list. You see I’m not myopic on this subject. I have real life to support my beliefs. They aren’t born from church, government, or emotionalism; it’s born from real life experience not any propaganda.

So if you really want to be knowledgeable about the entire picture, you have to also see the dark underbelly that drugs have. Yes, even pot.

I know that what I say will fall on deaf ears because in my experience the most closed minded people I have ever met are the people that scream that others are being closed minded. These “open minded” people only believe you to be open minded if you change your views and beliefs to match theirs. If you have your own views and beliefs then you are closed minded or have been brainwashed by government, church, or other organizations. Because you couldn’t possibly believe the way you do if it were not true. HUH how closed minded of them to believe others can’t come to their own conclusions.


On the topic of making pot legal, I have no opinion. My only point is that people should truly “Learn before they judge”, and that means to understand all points of view not just their own. And once they have seen all sides then they should be free to make there own conclusions.

since i dont feel like argueing I shall say your stories are pretty bullshit.
Number one marijuana has no addictive chemicals so only
people who are easily addicted are in turn gunna be addicted.
it again falls back on the user and not the drug.
Your number two story is just plain stupid but im tired its early
and dont feel like argueing so ill stop here seeing as people will still think what they want to. And you may think I only believe my side of it etc but I have spent countless hours learning about marijuana and no quite a bit on the subject and thats why I can say that marijuana would never be the cause of some already crazy fucker with severe problems whos goin off to rape his fucking wife.

and actually i've not always lived in a decent sized house or had things handed to me.
There was time before my mom was with my step dad, before her promotions where i was living in a basement suit. I still hang around the same people, been around lots of people that have had rough lives... I hang out downtown where im from at a part where crack heads are sitting on the corner from the bus sstop, im sure loveless has heard of langley center and its "dangers". On top of this my dad was an alcholic and a coke user who hit my mom. So I have seen the good and bad in drugs ofcourse. But in the end with pot it all comes down to the person and not the drug, because the drug is not mind altering and does not make you do something stupid like when you are drunk.



And about those stories, I don't wanna seem like a heartless dick who doesnt give a rats ass but all those stories can relate back to the people.


As for the first story, hmm maybe the man did rails before he went, cause often if there doin other drugs people usually smoke dope still.
( i've sold weed to alot of jib/crack heads )

I see theres both sides and where other people see it from but see it from a stoners point of view who has spent hours researching pot. Hours watching movies, I've had long conversations with thee "marijuana man" and marc emery while I'm blazin at the BCMP and I know its negative effects and for someone to beat there fuckin kids over it well that man is already fucked in the head before the weed. not weeds fault, mans fault ;P

you are absolutely right it isnt the drug that makes them do it no more than alcohol makes a person beat his wife. It just gives them the inhibitions to do what they want with out regards to how it effects others.

I am not arguing at all. I am just saying that there are other experiences out there. You say that no one has ever been hurt by pot. but would the guy who abducted me as a child done it sober. would he held me by knife point and abused me if he was sober. Yes it wasn't pot that made him do it. I never said it was. It just gives sick people the guts to do what they want.

But I am glad you are open minded enough to see others points of view... ohh wait your not.

so using your line of thinking it isn't the coke or alcohol that causes people to beat their wife it is just the person.

^ I don't see what's wrong with Mikey's argument here. He says that marijuana doesn't make you beat your kids any more than you normally would. Or any more that alcohol would. Isn't that it?

Like Manz said...

The stuff within alcohol and weed lowers your inhibitions.

Definitions of inhibition on the Web:

• (psychology) the conscious exclusion of unacceptable thoughts or desires.

Then when your inhibitions are lowered... you say, think and do things you normally wouldn't do.

Like how drunks are either really emotional or do retarded things... like sleep with people they wouldn't ("beer goggles"), or start fights over petty things.

Your inhibitions are what keep you from acting upon impulse, and what make you think before you act.

I think the key phrase to memorize in this situation is "correlation does not equal causation." Cannabis also tends to lower aggressive feelings. If anything, it would have a calming influence on a person. I have to say tends, because anything dealing with the human body could affect different people in different ways, but because someone develops a rash with penicillin, should everyone be barred from using it?

I'm not saying that everyone who tokes up is a harmless fuzzball, that depends on how the person is without being on weed. If you're a dick sober, you'll still be a dick on weed. Did the person also watch TV the night before? Should we ban TV? Did the person drive to the crime? Should we ban cars? Yes, those are ridiculous examples to jump to, but they have as much evidence linking the causality to the actions as weed.

That was just my point. I believe from what I have seen of this thread it is all gumdrops and flowers when people toke. I was just trying to show a different perspective that it isn't all fluff and happiness with regards to those that toke.

I really don't stand on either side of the whole leagalization usage point. I don't see much difference between pot and alcohol (except that you can have a beer and not be drunk but you really can't have a joint and not be high). I believe I have stated something similar in every post. I just wanted to show that it isn't all giggles when it comes to the people that use weed.

But I think the point is getting lost.

Well, on that we can agree. There are some dangers of using pot. I don't think anyone has really denied that. I think the gist of what's been said is that the percieved dangers aren't borne out by facts.

However, people engage in activites all the time that could cause some harm to themselves. Life is about risk. Should a government be in the business of protecting citizens from themselves? For their own good? That's antithetical to what this country was founded upon. My arguments might not hold sway in the nanny-states of the UK or Australia, but personal freedom should be our highest ideal in the US.

Im gonna go ahead and weigh in with my opinion here...

first, i'd like to state my position here. im against pot. im against all drugs. that includes alcohol, cigarettes, weed, etc, etc... it's shown throughout musical history that it's no good. Hendrix took too many sleeping pills, and i believe alcohol, and choked on his vomit. Kurt Cobain suffered massive depression because of heroine, and though i still doubt he killed himself, he was certainly on the verge of it. Elvis, (though i dont particularly care for his music) OD'd. Sid Vicious OD'd, i believe, and the life of his girlfriend Nancy is popularly believed to be extinguished by either drug dealers or a drug-crazed Sid. John Lennon didnt die because of drugs, but he nearly lost his wife because of alcohol abuse.

Hrae, as for your last statement, the government IS in the business of keeping people from things that'll ruin their life. How are drug dealers who know the damaging effects of their drugs any different from murderers? how are tobacco industries, who know that their products kill people from the inside out, any better than people selling cyanide-laced donuts?

You may claim that it's a matter of freedom, if you wish, but what about teenagers, who are influenced heavily by their peers? do they have full freedom to choose, or are their choices forced by their "friends"?

And don't claim i'm just some conservative republican who's got his head in the past. im an anarchist. i consider myself an independent, only due to the democratic views which disregard life for freedoms (i.e. abortion.)

I don't judge people for their choices. it's their life, not mine. but if they start pushing drugs, it's a matter of other people's personal freedoms. To some, peer pressure can override their own morals.

This, of course, ignores all of the contributions that drugs have made to the various creative processes to musicians, of course. Do you think we would have had Yellow Submarine without drugs? It's sort of a wash. Bill Hicks put it nicely (coarse language, be warned):

But this is not really the topic at hand. I'm not advocating for the legalization of ALL drugs, after all.

Because with alcohol, tobacco, and weed it is consensual. Donuts without the cyanide will kill you if you ingest enough of them...should they be rationed out for our own good? If we win a fight with Eurasia, will our chocolate rations go up?

Trust me, if a teenager wants to get weed, he or she can get weed now. Drug dealers don't check IDs.

That sounds like a personality flaw, then. Why should my freedoms be abridged because some people lack self-control? Sometimes sex can be detrimental to public health. Should sex be regulated by the government as well? Should we ration donuts because someone can't stop eating them?

On a side note, I haven't brought political parties into this. Why? I'm for the most part a Republican, in the Goldwater vein. I'm fiscally conservative and socially liberal. The neoconservative movement getting into bed with religion has brought the party to near ruin. There are some of us left that actually believe in personal responsibility. I suppose that's more of a topic for another thread...

I was simply providing something to prevent me from getting attacked, i have respect for the republican party, as much of my family was republican. im sorry, i shouldn't have brought that up, in retrospect. However, i stand by the rest of what i said. a person's life is more valuable to me than music, especially something like yellow submarine.

Hmmm I was talking about this to a friend and he said 'Bob marley' died from Cannabis overdose, I'm too lazy to check but yeah D:

EDIT:
Looked it up and yeah, my friends are retarded :D

wiki says:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_marley


<_< you editted while i was reading

Part of the reason this topic is so clouded and confused has to do with the history of how pot was made to be illegal.

Here's a brief synopsis. It was 1929 and there was a lot of corruption (as there is in all government) in the Bureau of Prohibition. Harry J. Anslinger was appointed as Commissioner to a newly created Federal Bureau of Narcotics (FBN). He needed a campaign that would take the scrutiny off of the government, his agency and himself.

He held a conference on the limitation of Marijuana where he invited 42 experts from around the nation to ask them what they knew about it. Only one person out of the 42 fit the viewpoint of Anslinger, but that was all it took to help him have a small amount of credibility in his campaign of lies.

Over the next few years he convinced the american public, with no scientific consensus (only his lone "expert") that marijuana causes "insanity, criminal acts and death."

Later his story changed to "Marijuana is the gateway drug" because too many people were using the statement that the drug caused insanity as a defense in court for murders. But the perception remains.